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Ideology over all

By mmhiga - Posted on 11 December 2011

You would think that basic intelligence, logic and evidence should be enough for ordinary people like us to make correct decisions. However, as this podcast from unfortunately suggests, ideology and the need to fit in trumps all.

"Sometimes you're the windshield, sometimes you're the bug." -- Mark Knopfler

Just put this onto my ipod. Thanks for the find!

I am not sure if it was Kelly or Tom who expressed concern regarding an Obama and Gingrich match up for the Presidency???---  I can see why now after watching the debate yesterday. Gingrich dominated most of the debate last night rather smoothly and he sliced and diced his opponents apart  with a smile on his face!! LOL--- He certainly knows how to frame his words ( which are lies).  He stood on that stage as if it belonged to himself  and he got a lot of applauds for his STRONG statements which he declared as being the "TRUTH" . He really thinks that he is the voice of reason for the American People!! ---- However, he is truly appeasing to the base with the war rhetoric and that the Middle east is the enemy and WE must be reactionary to the Muslims!-- The same crock of bull that Bush stated that got us into two wars which is difficult to get out of!!!!


I believe the BASE is jumping on Gingrich's bandwagon. He may not be a 100% of what the base, tea party, right wing extremists are looking for but he comes 50% close to where they want him to be and he is perceived to be knowledgeable about politics ( although I think he is all talk and full of crap with no integrity LOL). I think he is going to remain the front runner at this point. Huntsman is too Moderate ( Glorified Liberal LOL) .  Gingrich certainly has a super ego!! LOL--- I wonder what do the rest of the RFO think about Newt Gingrich at this point?? I  am very open to your ideas and be very interested in y'all insights!! 

1. Do you think he has a strong possibility of being in the General election??

2. How do  you think he will compete with President Obama???

3. Do you think he stands a chance of winning  over Obama or do you think he will give Obama a hard time??

4. What do you think should be Obama's strategy against Gingrich in order to stay on top of the debate??

5. What do you perceive as Obama's "Room for improvement" in the debate with Gingrich??

6. What can we expect from Newt Gingrich in the debate with President Obama??

7. How you perceive that President Obama will cope or deal with the debates with Gingrich??

8. What do you perceive as Obama's strength?? and what do you perceive as Gingrich strength??


So far it has been very enlightening for me to read a lot of views on this site and I have learned so much just reading different perspectives. I know  I don't have all the answers, I just have an opinion.  I know there are a lot posters on this site who are experts in the field of Law and finance and it has given me a broader insight of politics and it has shaped the way I view the political process. I came on this site knowing absolutely nothing about the political process, nor about Budgets, Deficits, Finance, or the Electorate!! LOL Yikes!  But it has been a growing experience for me to tap into a site full of intelligent, diverse and courageous people!!!----

I know I am not the main poster that y'all normally communicate with but I would much appreciate if y'all would respond to the questions as I do respect every ones input.  I realize that people have their usual posters that they feel comfortable and prefer to communicate with but I am requesting for some of  the casual posters to come outside of their comfort zones and give their perspective to the questions.Thanks ahead!  

You ask some great questions here, Latrece.  I had to really stop and think.  Let me try to give my opinions....

1. As time goes by, I think the possibility of Newt becoming the candidate becomes stronger.  Will he crash and burn like the other "not-Mitt" candidates remains to be seen, but at this point, I don't count him out.

2. He will probably compete by assuming his professorial "I know everything" air, combined with that slice and dice attitude you pointed out.  He will no doubt work to appeal to the far right, Tea Party base.

3. I think Newt will be easier to defeat, but I also believe it will make for a very ugly campaign. 

4. Obama's strategy....Stay focused on his many strengths, be agressive enough to show his leadership ability, but "nice guy" enough to make Gingrich look like the jerk. ;-)  Focus on the real policy differences between the two, strongly pointing out which is best for the American people.  Point how how damaging to recovery the Republican obstructionism, based on protecting the wealth, has been for our economy.  

5. Room for improvement...Be more to the point.  Don't come across as professorial, but rather as a strong and decisive President.

6.I expect Newt to be cutting and brash, with right wing foreign policy and economic proposals.

7. Obama will deal with it as he deals with everything...calmly and with apolmb...and possibly a bit of humor.

8. Obama's strengths are his calmness and intelligence, his foreign policy successes, and his vast knowledge and grasp of facts when it comes to policy.  Newt's biggest strength, IMO, (aside from the fact that he is also very intelligent) is that he's been in the political arena for so long, he can take a punch with our flinching, and with a condescending smile and attitude.

I too would like to hear other's thoughts on the subject. 

Wow!! Suzi  your responses were great!! ---I didn't anticipate you answering all of them but thanks a million!!  LOL---- I think we think along the same lines?? Hmmmm? I would have to agree with your assessment regarding Newt Gingrich's ability to take a punch and keep on ticking LOL-- He is a tough old guy!--- I finally feel that President Obama is ready to take on this battle with whoever turns out to be in the general election!---  I do agree that this campaign is going to get nasty!! -- I like your suggestion ( My rephrasing  you LOL) that Obama has to be  NICE NASTY AND STRONG! LOL hahaha -- Well not real nasty lol    The only candidate who I would feel a little apprehensive about President Obama going up against is Gov Huntsman because he seems legitimate, real,  extremely intelligent and possibly with a good track record as a Governor!!-- Thanks for your response!!

I would be more worried about Huntsman too, for the very reasons you mentioned.  The one good thing is it would probably be a fairly clean and civil election. 

I think Huntsman's Achilles' heel would be his support of the Ryan plan.  Of course, this will be a weakness for any GOP candidate. 

Someone said on CNN this morning that McCain was in 4th place at this point in the 2008 election, so I'm not counting anyone out at this point.  But the one thing the Republican party seems to do is give everyone their turn....and it's Mitt's turn.

Well I am somewhat disenchanted and let down that there is little participation and  engagement on the discussions leading up to the next Presidential election on this site.  I have noticed some  topics being presented and some comments made on the topics but I haven't seen much real exciting discussions on the issues as we are coming into the New Year on this site; I guess this site has transformed more into  an information board ( gathering) rather than a forum for discussions relative to the issues and challenges facing President Obama.

I am beginning to wonder does the moderators  of this site think that the discussions will create  disharmony of the site because of varying  viewpoints?? Is there some apprehension, unwritten rule or policy change that I am not aware of  that discourages ongoing discussions on this site? maybe I am out of the loop??  I believe I recall one moderator indicating that it was too early for  people to began substantive discussions relative to this political climate and process. Unfortunately, I have not seen much support or solicitation from the moderators to inspire such discussions.

There used to be 30, 40, 50 comments per topic but now if there is Ten plus responses to one topic, that is considered a good day. So far, I have seen  51 comments related to Herman Cain's sexual harassment . I am not sure why this topic was given WAY more credence than any other issues related to Obama.  Anyway, I won't  use anymore of my valuable time and energy trying to bring attention to this subject. I am sure the formality will remain the same. I am just sadden that this forum is not as exciting as it used to be.


Moving on to my usual flow. I really enjoyed looking and listening to the interview that President Obama did on 60  Minutes last night. The questions were your usual talking points related to the Republicans. I thought the interviewer 's questions were direct and in your face type of questions; however, I really embraced this style of questioning because this will help and prepare President Obama to deal with the upcoming debates!-- I hope more reporters, and journalists continue to ask him more hard lined questions because it will  sharpen and increase  his response time. He seemed to handle the questions much more easily this time than he has done in the past. He came across as more assured, confident and comfortable in his own skin as President.


I am both excited and anxious to see how this election process will evolve. I know we can't take anything for granted and we have to be very vigilante in getting the word out for people to vote vote vote!!------ Below is the link to the Video of President Obama's interview on 60 Minutes  last Night.;contentAux


I don't recall many campaigns or elections since JFK vs Nixon being based on substantive issues and policy discussion: Peformance, polish, blunders, fear mongering, and personal narratives (one's own or those fashioned by the opposition) pretty much is how it goes. (Hence Romney' $10,000 bet, which in terms of policy and issues and even character is totally meaningless, was the headline of the debate).

I am not saying this cynically.  I just don't fault the moderators or "posters" (of which I am one) for framing some of the election discourse, maybe even most of it, in these terms.

I was one of the posters here (I doubt the only one) who believes there is more to fear from Gingrich PRECISELY because he moves so well in this arena -- convincing a large portion of the public and media that he has "ideas" and "policies" and "philosophy" when what he has, basically, is an astonishing talent for grabbing headlines and demonizing opponents in a manner  they cannot adequately combat.

For example, Gingrich to Romney,  "Let's be honest. The only reason why you are not a career politician is that you lost to Ted Kennedy in 1994 (or whenever it was).A good hard double sting: you are a career politician and you are not honest about it.

Would Romney ever say to Gingrich: "Let's be honest. The only reason why you are not in prison is that Georgia does not enforce its adultery laws."  

No. In his defense, Romney has more character and decency than that and that kind of slime would not play well coming out of him. It plays GREAT coming out of Gingrich.

Romney has few ups and few downs. Gingrich has huge ups and huge downs, I ain't afraid of the "downs" but as for the "ups"...   look out, Pres. Obama.

I am anticipating this coming election with whoever the challenger may be; however, I am somewhat concerned about voter fraud and suppression during the voting process because the GOP is soooo desperate!!---- I wonder will they come up with another law or something to hamper redistricting?? identification, timing ( time frames) for voting, will they limit the amount of voting poll sites??? Will they change the length of time that the polling places stay open for voting??!! --I do not rule out anything from the Republicans because a lot hinges on this election!!

They are already passing laws in congress to tie the President's hands; such as, there should not be any negotiations with Iran; I do understand that they were able to get quite a bit of democrats on board too!! However, the republicans are seizing every opportunity to get at the President! I am sure some of the Democrats are bitter at President Obama because he went against the grain of the party or maybe some of the democrats wanted to demonstrate bipartisanship??-- This fight in Washington is getting uglier and uglier!!---- Yet they continue to blame President Obama ( the right wing media) for not being persuasive enough or wiling to compromise with Congress. In each press conference,  the reporters  constantly asks the press secretary whether President Obama  communicated directly with Congress; they consistently grill the Press secretary to find out if there is still direct talks from the President to Congress.


It has been demonstrated over and over that these defiant bitter congressman will not negotiate or compromise at no point!! President Obama can not FORCE these grown adults to cooperate, because that would be  an assault or unconstitutional!!  each time the press confronts president Obama, they continue to ask him how is he going to continue to negotiate and compromise with Congress!! or come up with alternative ways to get congress to agree with him!! I have never seen in all MY life that a "President is constantly asked what is he doing to get Congress to act responsibly" . ---if the president declared that  congress would not cooperate, then that was the end of that discussion!! The focus then turns to Congress and the gridlock!! ---If I am misguided then I stand corrected. I believe the president needs to continue to speak to the American people and not be distracted with all the noise and foot stomping that Congress is doing!!

If President Obama has to go up against Newt Gingrich, I realize that Newt brings  a wealth of experience, knowledge, tactics and insight, but I am comfortable that President Obama will be able to navigate himself around Newt Gingrich fairly reasonably. I am sure Newt will hit very swiftly and sharply; he will point out all the  President's failures and broken promises  that the President did not accomplish. However, the President can point out the most Critical and vital thing that he did to save the Country from plunging into a major depression; he can also express that as a candidate that he did not have privy to certain information in order to know the extent of the massive problem and damage that was done to the economy!! 

He can insist that as  becoming President, he was allowed access to see  the magnitude of the problem in real time!! Also, he can identify what were his immediate goals and priorities verses his long term goals because that is what governing is all about. Governing is not playing Santa clause  by making wishes come true but it is about prioritization and putting  policies in place that will affect short term needs and move towards long term goals. I really like Chris Matthew's analogy of the President; as well as, his perspective on the state of the GOP and their motivation!! --Here is a Link to Chris's  site:


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